RECREATION ADVISORY BOARD
MINUTES OF APRIL 25, 2001
Joe Criscuolo, Chairman, called the meeting to order at 7:45 pm. In attendance at this time:
Tom Badcock, Barbara Felice, Richard Bezeg, Fran DiRocco, Joe Dunn, Denis Kilduff, Tim Kozlak, Harold Reck, Joe Rumolo, Megan Condran (student), Anthony Marinos (student). Carol Norberg was present to take the minutes. Councilman Richard Greene arrived at 7:50 PM and Gerard Haran arrived at 7:55 PM Mr. DiRocco visited at 8:15 PM Absent from this meeting were: Janet Phillips (had a family confirmation), John Piovesan, Joe Pruiti, Paul Taguer (in Mrytle Beach for cheerleading competition) and Councilman Ed Testino.
Approval of Minutes
All members present approved the minutes of the February meeting. No one present was opposed. The minutes from last month's meeting (March) did not get out to members in time for approval. Motion was passed to postpone the approval of the March minutes until the May, 2001 meeting.
Old Business
Skate Park:
Joe C. asks Tom to give findings on the skate park for the weeks the children were out on Easter break keeping in mind that it was a rainy week.
Tom: Like we said earlier, you can't compare an Easter week to a summer vacation, but at least it gives some indication. Even though it was a rainy week, we had a good number of kids, 77 the first day, which was a nice day. One thing that was interesting, which we hope not foreboding, but in the back of our minds we always thought it would be the case, if you look at the number of nonresidents, the totals for the week for the five days were 245 kids, 96 of those kids were nonresidents. The other thing that is a little unnerving is that it wasn't just from a couple of towns, it was probably 15 different municipalities who had kids representing them. What that tells us is the word is out there, sooner or later that word will filter through to other kids in those towns that we have a skate park. We are all in agreement, I think, the professional staff and the board on just holding off any fee structure until we get more information. This is just a start and will serve as a beginning, but I think we will continue to monitor it this way during the course of the summer and see where we go. We have a back-up plan also. We've made up tags in different colors that we have a maximum in the park in one particular hour, then we'll begin going on the hour and moving in the kids in the waiting group, and keep rotating the children that way with the different colored tags that are numbered one through fifty. We have a contingency plan if it does get really crowded. I think we need to take the whole first summer of data before we can assess what the real impact is going to be. One thing that is interesting is that if you look at the breakdown of boards, skates and bikes. Skateboards were the highest use, followed by skates and bikes. The biggest concern, obviously, is the bikes. Because if the bikes start to get crowded at any given time, we might want to earmark some time just for bikes.
Joe Dunn mentions that he went down on that Saturday. He mentions that the park was pretty jammed. There was one kid from Long Island that was visiting his grandparents in East Brunswick. He asked the parents about charging fees, and mentions that not one parent from Old Bridge had a problem with a fee. One parent from out of town was surprised we weren't charging a fee.
Tom states that he's been getting a lot of calls from other towns who are trying to get support for a skate park in their town. If they get skate parks, or if they don't get them, it will also affect our summer traffic. He thinks it will significant if they don't get their own skate park.
Joe Dunn said he talked to the special, who said that five or six different towns have been taking pictures. Some of the older kids did not want any fees, but if the money was to go back into the park (to fix it or buy new equipment) then it was OK with them. Also, parents he spoke to had no problem with charging a fee to keep the out-of-town traffic down.
Tom said that there was money to do one more piece in there and that one of the kids on the skate park committee was helping finalize those plans.
The members and Tom talk about some repairs that need to be made in the park to some of the pieces due to the snow this past winter and the kids using the pieces. Joe C. asks if tarps can be used to cover them in the winter. Tom says they are looking into it and also having the parks men to brush it off, especially on the half pipe. Tom also reminds everyone that the fees would not make too much money, they wouldn't even cover half of the special's cost for the year.
The members review the schedule Tom provided which showed the fees that other town's charge for their skate parks. Denis mentions that Belmar will be charging a fee starting this summer because of the crowding.
Joe C. asks Tom if a system can be implemented to monitor the skate park throughout the summer. He requests that at the next meeting Tom can outline how it will be monitored.
Tom mentions that they will probably some of our current employees and some part-time employees to monitor it just like was done for Easter vacation.
Joe C. says he was disappointed that the weather wasn't nice and that we couldn't get an accurate view of what will occur in the summer. He looks forward to the September meeting when full summer usage will be known, and a report can then be prepared for council.
Fran mentions there is a skating area in Aberdeen that the kids use down by her, and that the parents were confusing it with our skate park. They were going to go the council meetings and complain about the suggested fees, but Fran mentioned to them the park the kids were using was an Aberdeen park, not the skate park in Old Bridge.
Feasibility Analysis of the Proposed Golf Course
Joe C: I believe that all members of the committee have received from the council a copy of the Feasibility Analysis of the Proposed Old Bridge Golf Course dated June 1999. I talked to a couple of the council members and the members of this committee who volunteered to look into this. I am also glad to see that Tom had some quick turnaround on a golf course project professional recommendation. What I would like to have done is the members of the sub committee of this group, I believe was headed up by Joe D., I think Joe Rumolo and Gerard Haran was on this sub committee, I know I haven't had a chance to look at the report or Tom's professional recommendation, to pick a time to meet and discuss what they think of the proposal. Anyone else that wants to be on that committee can be a part of it. So I would ask Joe to call a sub committee member meeting of that. Also, please keep in mind that the data that is enclosed in the 1999 feasibility study, the analysis is sensitive data. Please, we stress to you, please keep it safeguarded. This is highly sensitive information. I know that was one of Tom's concerns in the past, and I second that after seeing the report. What I would like to ask if Joe can call a subcommittee meeting when everyone has had a chance to look at the document and take a look at it and maybe come up with questions, concerns or comments that you have and get it back to a council member. I know the council is looking to revalidate it if that's the right word.
Tom: The validation is there, it's just that they are looking to see if the market has changed any in the last two years. I think, again, when you read my report, one of the things council wanted was to get a little more feel. I know what the market is because I'm involved in it. It's not the council's day-to-day life to know what the golf market is in New Jersey, so I can understand their needing more information. I don't have a problem with that as long as they get it from a reliable company that has done golf course financials before. You must get somebody that will do it right. We are not afraid of information because I know the information will always show there is an obvious need out there. The most critical thing when you read that report from me is that when the time comes to move forward on this, is that we install a guy, and my recommendation is the same guy who did this study because of his extensive background in many phases of golf operation, to have him as our paid consultant who would work with our professionals in securing a golf course architect, who would work on course designing, course tracking, layout, development of plans and specs for the bid, would monitor the bid, monitor the work at the construction site, that's all highly critical, and without that, God knows what can happen.
Joe D. asks about the Lambertson tract.
Tom: The Lambertson tract, now that we are moving to acquire that, we have run into a stalemate in the negotiations, and Bill Ruggierio and I have definitive ideas as to why that is, what we have decided to do and the council agreed to is to, and I think very wisely, we are just going to acquire the property by recalling our rights of eminent domain. We are still leaving a window of opportunity if they want to negotiate with us, but we are just going to take it and pay fair market value, which we expected to pay anyway. $3 million is the new appraisal that I got from our certified appraisers, it is verified by Green Acre's established fair market value which is roughly $3 million, of which we will get paid 50%. Originally, the FMV was closer to $2.1 million, and we were going to get 50% of that. Now we will get 50% of a higher amount. That is what we are eligible for, and that is what we are getting, regardless of whether we settle for $3 million, $2.75 million.
Joe D: When do you think this whole thing is going to go down?
Tom: Probably, by the time Ruggierio goes the whole way, it may not be until the fall until we have the land, but the bottom line is that once it goes into condemnation and the council approves that they are going to put the money forth, it will happen. We will get the property, its just a matter of when we get. I want you to know something else. Regardless of what you may hear, I heard it at the council meeting but didn't respond to it, there were some comments made that if we never got the Lambertson property, we can't build a golf course. That is totally false. There are a couple of good golf courses in Monmouth County built on 100 acres. That's is 138 acres, the Rose Farm. In Atlantic Highlands, Beacon Hill, which is a very exclusive country club, the holes are a little tight, they play statewide events there, it's built on 100 acres. So, when somebody says to you if we don't get Lambertson it's impossible to do a golf course, that is totally erroneous. 138 acres is more than enough to build a championship golf course. The reason why we want the other side because it allows the opportunity, which you can read in your report, to build a large two sided driving range which will make a good deal of money, and we would also be able to augment our junior golf program, and also give us a little more flexibility on routing of the holes. But don't let anybody tell you that you can't build a course just on the Rose Farm because you can.
Joe D: How long does it take to build a golf course?
Tom: Probably in construction probably anywhere from 9 - 13 months, actual construction depending on your sight. We have a pretty good site because it is more rolling farm field and not too much wooded. It is not as big a problem as if you were in all tree area, or in a rocky area. This is easier to do the earth work. It will also take 8 months to a year to do all your engineering work, utility work and design work. It's in the report too. By the time you move into the phase of getting a golf course architect on board, it usually anywhere from 2.5 to 3 years. It is not an overnight process.
Fran asks about lighting on the practice ranges.
Tom: When he originally came in I asked him to do it with lights and without lights. The reason is I wanted to see both ways, the financials, I don't envision that the range will have lights because it is in a highly residential area, even though the lighting they are talking about are not the big things on poles, it would be down range lighting, which is ground level lighting. It is still something I didn't envision, but I just wanted to have him do a comparison to see what the difference in the amounts that you would get with a lighted range and with a non-lighted range. Just so you get a little feel for the type of numbers that would happen with each of those. Very few courses in our area, public or private course, that have lighted ranges. Most of them are just separate driving ranges, and most of them are in non-residential areas for the most part. It just gives you more time available in the summer months, but it is not a huge difference.
Denis: You could always add lights later on.
Tom: I don't envision it. Because of the place of where it is. I think you'd have a lot of resentment from the surrounding communities, and rightfully so.
Megan asks where the high school uses for golf practice and tournaments. Tom responds they use Glenwood Country Club, they get practice time in the beginning of the year, but they don't have much time to go on the course.
Gerard: According to Donna Ryan, Athletic Director for Old Bridge Schools, she says the golf teams were getting squeezed for time over at Glenwood.
Tom: Glenwood itself is in a very precarious position. Because it is a low-end private club. I've been a member there for 16 years, it's a great layout, but what I mean is that it is in the market now competing with some of these daily fee courses. If membership at Glenwood is $4,000, you would have play 40 rounds of golf per year, which is a lot, you'd pay $100 a round. Now for $100 a round, you could go to any of these upscale daily fee public courses and pay $70, $80 or $90 dollars, which includes a cart, lunch and a valet. Some people who are playing 30 - 40 rounds of golf per year are deciding not to go to Glenwood, they can go somewhere else and play these other courses. The ones who play more than that are going to stay, obviously. That's what's happening to Glenwood. They are losing members.
Joe R: How much did the T&G study cost?
Tom: $17,500.
Joe R: How long did it take to pull it all together?
Tom: About 3 months.
Joe R: Can you identify any alternative groups that have that kind of expertise that we could use to do the same study?
Tom: There is a couple. Himanshu has a couple of different accounting companies that have a division that does that. We have one in already and we are looking at one or two others.
Joe R: Is that already in the plan to get someone else...
Tom: We have to fund it. I don't think there is any money to do a second study in the budget. There is no money to hire the guy that I want to be the clerk of the works right now, I've requested that money be put in for that. The bonding that was just voted on doesn't include any of that money. I originally put in $300,000 which is roughly half of your engineering golf course design fee based on what our estimate of our course will be to get it started, but what I've asked for now is to get the consultant on board to start the process of tracking and identifying with us the opportunities, the different types of golf course architects in the market that we can start interviewing and get an idea. If we do the bonding a year down the road, we don't have to begin the process of interviewing then, we've already done it. When the money is approved by the council, we can award it very shortly after. Because as we talking about, now you are pushing it back four years. If you wait this whole year before you can get a tee in the ground and start creating revenue, now you are moving back to four years. This is not a rush job. If you hear that we are trying to rush this course through, you can't rush a golf course through. It's a long, involved process and to have the revenue start flowing, you have to begin the process. We are just trying to get the process begun.
Joe R: What's your estimate of total expenditure?
Tom: Just to build it? Probably he gave us a high end estimate because he was trying to be very conservative in the report. Probably in today's market and what we are looking at for the size and the location and the market conditions, probably anywhere from $6 to $6.5 million to build it.
Richard Greene: Joe, I just want to comment on what you were talking about originally. A couple of weeks ago the council had a long public discussion on how to go on this. Some people questioned whether we were going to do a report. Himanshu had actually gone out and got one of the accounting firms who said they were interested in taking a look at it. Ultimately, after a lengthy discussion that night, it was tabled. Monday night, we did as Tom said, we approved a bonding ordinance, first reading, and we did approve the ability for the township to go forward
on the purchase and/or condemnation.
Joe R: We are looking at $6.5 million of expenditures, it probably makes sense to spend another $20,000 to do a parallel study.
Tom: It certainly is. We are not saying by any means not to do it. Obviously we are trying to establish a comfort level for everybody. Its just what everyone is saying is to try to make sure you get someone who has done this before. The more they have done before, the better validity it will be.
Gerard: That's another $20,000 or $30,000 to tell us if there is enough people in this metropolitan area that want to play golf. Is that it?
Tom: That and what the cost and the expenses and the income...
Gerard: Or is the accounting firm there to see if the books of this golf course which doesn't exist, if they're set up right, we going to a big five, which is going to do a study on the feasibility of a golf course in the metropolitan area.
Tom: We know the numbers are there,
Gerard: Does this sound ridiculous to anyone else? Just let me know.
Tom: It's not just the numbers. We know the market is there, we are trying to identify and what Jim did in the report for us, a total report as far as expenditure and revenue. So you can look at every aspect of a golf operation, whether it is club house, pro shop, snack bar, golf carts, instruction, whatever down the line, you can get a general idea in our area what we conservatively expect to obtain. Also, on the same side are the expenses. What we have to pay for someone to manage it, somebody to run, to lease the carts, to maintain the condition of the course itself or equipment. What Jim did for us is basically give us a whole idea or budget of what a golf course in our area would do every year. What we could expect to make based on x amount of rounds a year which was conservative at a price that we already had put in based on the current market conditions in our area. And also on the expense side. So when you look at that whole report, you have to look at both ends of it. I think what Gerard is saying, and I know why he's saying it, there is not reason to doubt that we have the largest, other than maybe in Japan, we have probably the biggest golf market that there is in the US or in the world for that matter in our immediate vicinity. If you put a pin in Old Bridge and you went and did a 45 minute drive and you did a circle around Old Bridge, there is roughly six or seven million people within that circle of which there is X amount based on all the statistical data that would play golf X amount of times per year. A course can only accommodate so many rounds of golf a year. One of the things in my report was that Monmouth County has six course, they are building a seventh one, they have about 25,000 of their residents that have golf ID cards that allow them to call in and get a little bit of a jump on a start time and get a reduced rate. That's only roughly a small portion. If those people played even ten rounds a year each, I'm sure they are playing that on the average at least because they went and got their card, that's roughly covers 70% of the rounds that are available at all their courses through the course of the season. You can see there is a tremendous demand. That's just Monmouth County. A lot of people are coming from Middlesex, Staten Island. (Tom goes on to list some golf courses in Middlesex County)
Denis tells everyone he hasn't renewed his county card because there is no place to play, he goes out of county to play.
Joe D: Why are we doing another study, just to confirm that this guys numbers work?
Tom: I think because of the size of the project, the council are a little nervous and rightfully so, when you are going to expend $6-6.5 million on building a golf course, you want to have a realistic expectation of what your expenses and revenues will be on a year to year basis. In the report, Jim shows you and most of the courses will verify, you will always be ahead and depending on what type of deal you have with your management company and how extensive that is, how far ahead you will be. But you will always make money. The only thing that kills a public course in any fashion is if you have rain or some disaster where your irrigation system blows up, and your course has to be torn up. Other than that, you will make your money.
Gerard: Aren't the operations of the Monmouth County Park system public information?
Tom: Yes. I talked to Jim Truncer who is a friend of mine and he runs the county park system, and also Dave Compton, who is a friend of mine who runs the golf operation. In my report also is that we should get them, we are going to spend all this money, we can easily get Monmouth County's information, all their statistics...
Gerard: Let me ask you this. If we are going to go ahead with the clerk of the works, which is the intelligent way to spearhead the project, why couldn't that individual do that same thing? Here's what a big five is going to do. They are going to take some junior accountant, somebody with three or four years experience, and that is the guy or gal who will be billed at enormous dollars an hour because of the name that they have. They are going to get on the phone to those golf courses down there and ask them for the information on the last five years operations. Then they'll go to the federal government and get census data. And they are going to look at that data and compile that information. And they'll hit you with a bill probably about $35,000. That's what's going to be done. So is the purpose for this to help us decide, or is the purpose of this so the politicians can feel good about going forward on this?
Tom: The purpose of getting another report would be to give them a comfort level to verify the report that Jim gave us basically which says that we would make a surplus of money based on the demographics that are currently in place in our region. It's basically saying that Jim's report is great and sounds good, let me get a second opinion.
Gerard: Now we won't break ground for another 18 months, and obviously then we will need another report.
Tom: No, what my recommendation is, and Rich is here who can verify that, is that I would like to get this guy on board. It is not a huge contract, it will only take $4,000 to get him moving into the place where we are, starting to look at interviewing golf course architects and things like that. We can get him to do what we are talking about for a very small fee also, Gerard. But I don't know whether the council is ready to move to that point...(interference from the microphone)... there is not money unless the money is going to come from another place. There hasn't been money earmarked for at least the preliminary report of Jim's contract and/or a second report by another agency.
Joe C: What I would like to do is table this issue and have the golf subcommittee meet possibly before our next meeting. If the golf subcommittee's recommendation is to notify the council saying, maybe we don't need to do this follow-up report or whatever, then the whole committee will then take a look at that recommendation and vote on it and pass it on back to the council.
Joe D: Let me ask the council member, do you guys want another study to make sure that what this first report said, would you feel comfortable with a second report?
Richard: Personally, I was one that didn't feel and updated report was necessary.
Tom: This guy has done courses in NJ. Rich knows this too. This guy has done successful courses already in New Jersey, I think Rich is involved in finances and he is a little more at ease with the numbers, but we know that he has the ability in what he does has meaning, because he has a track record to go by.
Richard: What surprised me was that I thought there was movement during the meeting to get some kind of agreement to go forward, then all of a sudden there was a motion to table. That's where it went.
Joe D: What do you think the council wants? Do you think they want another study?
Richard: I think it would win on the council, but I believe some of them want to be more sure.
Joe C: Okay, so Joe D. if you can set that up, when you have the meeting date if you could pass it along to Carol and ask her to inform people in this committee about the meeting. We can follow-up on this particular issue at the next meeting.
Civic Center Basement Renovation
Tom: They are moving right ahead. We had another meeting with the architect today and the contractor, they are right on schedule and are doing a nice job. We have a couple of things we are waiting on, it will be a beautiful facility when it is finished.
Higgins Road Parking Lot
Tom: This is basically finished other than the gates. The council president has asked about putting in a split rail fence. We didn't have that as part of the project, that can be put in if there is a consensus of the council. The project came out very nice.
END OF TAPE ONE, SIDE A
Short Sided Soccer Fields at Elementary Schools
Joe C: There has been a stumbling block with the physical Ed. Depts. with the placement of the soccer goals at the elementary schools. Their impression was of our request was for portable type goal system that would be going in. I remember that I was pretty specific that we were looking for a permanent installation of these soccer nets at these elementary schools. I talked to the boys soccer league they've tried to approach the school system and say where would you like them so we can install them, stripe the field, etc. They met opposition in a sense that they would be a permanent type of goal situation. They are a little nervous about putting up portable goal systems because they are afraid they will disappear. Why would they go ahead and stripe the field when they weren't gonna be able to utilize it. It is still my belief on a lot of these schools there is plenty of room that we could put in some kind of permanent goals there, tomorrow I plan to make a couple of phone calls at least to Shepard School where my children go, I at least know the principal there and maybe I can drill down to the Phys. Ed. Instructor and say if it is impossible, let us know. But if it is possible, where would you like them. We are still trying to work that issue. We thought we made it past there. I also will be giving Fran Perino, the principal down in Voorhees...
Denis: Voorhees will not be able to have a soccer field. Its not big enough. That's where my daughter goes. The area is not big enough.
Joe C: Those were the two schools they had given us as sites. Maybe we'll work on Shepard for now and then push back and say Voorhees is not big enough and see if we can get other sites to do it at. My suggestion was that even if we don't have enough room to put a permanent full field in, at least if we could do half a field, because then you can play half-sided which a lot of times we do with practice. I will work on that to see if we could get it rolling again. I thought we were pretty far ahead with that, we thought it was a done deal. I thought it was too good to be true.
Genoa Playground
Tom: The playground is done. We are now moving the earth from the Higgins project over to do the topsoil and put it around the playground. We've gotten $25,000 request into the new CDBG budget to put in benches, picnic tables and fencing and some other amenities over there. The playground is usable. The fibar in the surfacing. All the old equipment is out of Genoa. We are waiting for the new money to do that. We'll seed it and get it ready.
Birch Hill
Joe C: I just wanted to bring it up, have we done anything else on Birch Hill. I don't think we did.
Tom: No.
Gerard: I've never been contacted by Kevin Calogera and his committee. I volunteered to be on that committee, and they never called me. Could you follow-up on that
.
Joe C: Barbara, maybe if they have their own voice mail, I know they are without a Director.
Tom: Right, there is not a full-time professional on staff.
Barbara: I can see if I can connect with them and get Kevin's number.
Tom: Rose LaFergola is the clerical assistant there, but they have not replaced the professional yet.
Joe C: I'll reach out to him and let him know that Joe R and Gerard have not been contacted yet on the feasibility study on Birch Hill.
(Joe goes over some of the enclosures in the package for this meeting, the summer camp handouts, etc.)
Denis: I want to let you know that the water fountain by the playground is not working in Vets Park.
Tom: It may be jammed up, or possibly have not been turned on yet. We'll check.
Joe C: Also in our packages is the report for the participation of the programs. It looks as if once again Barbara and her staff are doing an outstanding job of providing a good set of programs for all of us to attend if we wanted to. Also Pete Pero's Robin report is also enclosed. The other thing that was also in our package was the Recreation Strategic Plan for the next 7-10 years, which we asked for. Hopefully by next meeting if everyone can take a look at that and if you have any specific comments or concerns, if we could have a little walk through so that we understand everything that's in there. I'm sure that some of us who have been on the committee for some time, it will make sense. For others who haven't been on the committee for too long, you may have some questions on that. Carol, could you please put that on the agenda for the next meeting that we will take a look at that. I'd like to thank Tom for putting this together.
Barbara, did you want to give us any details from either the Recreation Program Update or the Robin Update?
Barbara: The only thing I'd like to mention is that the Roller Hockey Program is still registering now and that is really expanding every year. It is a very successful program. They are running it out of the Arena. He has 77 participants in that program. It will run through the summer. We have to close it down because of the Wrestling Festival, but then it picks right back up.
Joe C: I guess some of the only concerns is the air movement in there. Sometimes it gets extremely hot. That was the only negative comment I've gotten from people.
Tom: We have big fans that have helped a lot.
Barbara: They help a lot in the wrestling festival too. We are already up on the web with our summer programs.
Joe C: Hip Hop?
Barbara: Did you ask for it? Ask and you shall receive. We were very fortunate to have one of our dance instructors that was able to do it. The only other thing I'd like to mention is that we had our Easter Egg Hunt at Geick Park and it was really nice turnout. We probably had 400 kids up there. Fun was had by all. Our next big event will be our You name the Event Day. We are starting to get now in the children that are sending in their posters. We've got some cute ones in. Once we pick a winner, that will be our flyer. We are going to add sack racing to this event this year. We are looking to have a really good summer. We are excited that Kiddie Camp will be in our brand new basement.
Joe C: Hopefully next meeting we can have a tour.
Tom: We can try.
Joe C: Any new business Tom?
Tom: I would like to tell you a little bit more on Capital Projects.
Capital Projects
Beachfront:
Tom: I think you should all take a ride and check out the transformation of the beachfront in Laurence Harbor. Other than the fact that the building is way behind schedule because at this point it is non-existent. They had compaction problems, they got involved with the State. It needs to settle more. There have been some problems with flooding. Things that the engineers have to alleviate in that area. The boardwalk itself is terrific. If you like to run outside, you can run the boardwalk. It really looks nice.
Higgins
Tom: The contractor has already started to move the earth at the Higgins Road Restrooms/Concession building. He'll be moving on that. That should be completed by midsummer.
With the new bond ordinance that the council put through related to parks, there is money in there to do the parking area. We will revise the parking area at Ticetown Rd. complex to get a little more parking in there and off the street because it is dangerous. There is also some money for design fees for a recreation center in Ward 3, which is up near the Madison Park area by the apartments. We still have to identify a site for that. And then provided we get money which would be 50% in our state legislative grant which we anticipate, the council at that point would put in the other half of that money for that recreation center that we talked about which would be a cheerleading building. In addition to some equipment money and for some vehicles.
Denis: Where is that building going to be located?
Tom: We have it earmarked for Vets Park because, again, we have to look at the place that is most suitable. That park has the biggest buffer and it has an open area to use. There is nowhere in Geick that we can put it because we'd be moving in past the wetlands transition lines. There is no other place that we have that would be big enough to put it. It will fit nicely in Vets, that is the good news. The bad news is that there isn't any alternative spot. Out behind the softball fields, which is just a lot of trees, it will be buffered very well and we can take a road in from Summit Avenue to get to it and put a small parking area. It will be expensive.
Joe C: Anybody on the committee want to go over any new business that we haven't gone over yet?
Fran: The lights are out in the Cliffwood Beach Recreation building. There is only one light lighting the basketball court, but the residents whose kids play there, say at night the lights are off. Is there a reason?
Tom: I'll check. They might be on a timer.
Barbara: Nobody has reported that until now. We'll check it.
Joe C: Some observations that I've had. Your park staff, once again, has done a wonderful job of preparing the ball fields for the spring season. I think we should pass that along. Also, the Cheesequake Babe Ruth opened. Their fields look terrific. Sayrewoods South and Laurence Harbor Little League is open. Vinnie, the President from Laurence Harbor Little League passes along his thank you for helping him prepare the fields with the heavy equipment to soften up the soil. This year, Madison Park Little League opened again. It is our 45th anniversary. I did get some questions being that we had a lot of councilmen there and the Mayor about the house that's up there. I pointed out to Will that the trim on the house is really rotted away. We need to have that repaired or else we will start to get leakage into the building. Also comments from some of the people that were there regarding the flooring inside of that building.
Tom: That building should probably just be ripped down and rebuilt. Because all it was was an office for a housing. It was pretty nasty when we got it. That was ten years ago. It got donated to us and we moved it down the road. It wound up in Madison Park. It wasn't in good shape ten years ago when we got it. It was a sales office.
Joe C: Believe it or not, it actually serves a great purpose for the little league and the Cougars. I guess I'm asking you if we could possibly look into setting aside some money to have flooring replaced in the main area. The flooring in the bathrooms, which is linoleum, is fine. The flooring in the other part, just understand there is some hardwood floor, there's some carpeting and I guess where they had cubicles, they had cutouts in the carpeting. So it is a maze and Will had just put boards there. So there are all kinds of grooves in it and it just became more obvious to me when we had people up there. We would look for linoleum to be placed in there, or squares or something.
Tom: This is something that we will try to do what we can with operational money. I think what we need is a bond ordinance just to completely renovate that thing. This year we don't have it. We don't have the cash capital in our budget. But ideally, we wish we had 50,000 in cash capital, because this is that kind of thing that you could just take it and deal with the problem. It makes it hard to do something of this size out of an operating budget. Another thing is that it is a small project, it kind of gets lost in the shuffle for a bond ordinance. We are hoping that maybe the cash capital maybe in the next budget will be put back in.
Joe C: That would be good.
Joe D: What about money that Thompson got for Laurence Harbor Little League? He got like $100,000.
Joe C: Sam Thompson last year was looking at beachfront revitalization. For the whole district which goes down, not only including Old Bridge, but also including part Middletown, Aberdeen, Keyport and so on. So the state, as a good assemblyman should, he should be looking out for when there's grant money available for people in that particular area. Laurence Harbor, realizing that this money was available and they were X amount of miles from beachfront, they qualified underneath that program. So they worked diligently with Sam to file a grant application and they received $100,000. What they are planning to do, there is a detailed plan with the State right now, they have an auditor and an accounting firm watching how all the money is being spent. They are currently to begin building a new field house for their meetings and record keeping, computers. The bottom where the current concession stand is now is going to become storage area for their tractor and field maintenance equipment. Their current equipment are in tractor trailers which have the wheels cut off so they sit on the floor. They just get soaking wet. There's holes in the ceiling, it's all rotted out. They are planning to replace some fencing around a couple of their fields. The only really true luxury item that they will put in is a batting cage. If you want details on it, I'm sure Vinny could give you some more details. That's all I know at this point in time. That money was part of the waterfront revitalization program that Governor Whitman had put in place to make available some cleaning up of the bayfronts and so on.
Joe D: The only reason I'm bringing this is up is that you have needs, I'm sure Rebels have needs and all the rec. leagues have needs. Maybe instead of doing one thing for one league, maybe we recommend that all these recreation programs that are run by the soccer, baseball associations, maybe we should ask for a fund.
Joe C: They don't operate that way.
Tom: You have to watch because most of these are all private property. You have to be careful how the grants work. If we owned the properties as a township it would be one thing, but you have to remember all of our little leagues, except Sayrewoods South that is on township property, the rest are all private property, either leased or donated or give to the little leagues to use. What you must remember is that as a municipality you cannot fund on private property. You must be real careful.
Joe D: That goes back to this Madison Park thing. How are you bonding it at Madison Park?
Tom: The building is ours, it is a township owned little trailer.
Joe C: It is not a permanent structure. That's how we can have that there. It can be moved.
Tom: You are right. If you can do that, that would be the ideal way to do it. But you can't.
Joe C: You can qualify for some grants, but it just takes time to read through these. Unfortunately, in the town we don't have a grant writer. The school system doesn't either. Where if you had a very progressive school system like East Brunswick, they have someone whose full time job is to be a grant writer. They sit in their office and daily grants come out from the State and Federal government and their job is to review each of the grants that come out and say, let's try to get this money. It is their full-time job. I have some friends who, because I'm in the education field after they retired, they work as consultants for school systems in doing just that. They write grants. They get paid a percentage of the money they get in the grant. Its in their best interest to seek out these grants. There are grants available, it is just a very time consuming thing to sit down and look at them all. Because, believe me, when I saw they got $100,000, I thought wow, we could use $20,000 to replace my forty year old fence. We wouldn't qualify. And you can keep looking and naturally if I see something in my travels that would benefit any of you, I would point it out to you. It's a lot of paperwork to fill out. It's a lot of numbers. As Tom would know, we went for a couple of grants for the Robin Program and it is a tremendous amount of paperwork. Remember when we got the buses and the computers.
Joe D: It might be a good idea to reach out to Sam Thompson anyway.
Joe C: We did. I think after he got the money for Laurence Harbor, I think the majority of the leagues in his district called him.
Joe C: Just in wrapping up we said we would do a couple of things. We'll review the minutes from last meeting for approval. The golf subcommittee can take a look at the golf report and Tom's report and decide whether they need to meet or not. Review the 7-10 year outlook before the next meeting. Call on the EDC. I'll try to get in touch with the school system with regards to the short-sided soccer fields.
Gerard: I'd like to see the reports that all the leagues give in to Parks and Recreation for them to get their allocation. When was the last time you received reports.
Tom: We get them every year. We probably got them a couple of months ago.
Gerard: I'd like to take a look at those.
Tom: We have the files in the office.
Joe C: Please keep in mind the way we do stipends is based upon the fields, not purely by numbers of children participating.
Gerard: Obviously, you can imagine down at Cheesequake, there's a lot of consternation going on right now about the money going certain places for the number of kids who are playing. Especially with Cheesequake having a girl's softball league as well. So there's an awful lot of people wondering if the fair share, if things are being allocated...
Tom: Didn't we give an additional stipend to Cheesequake and we talked about that.
Joe C: Anything else? Motion to adjourn. (Everybody in favor)
Meeting ended at 9:00.
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